Forum Topic

West Ealing is becoming more dangerous

Within a week, there have been 2 knive attacks. One at Sylvester hair dressers in west Ealing and the other next door in the restaurant. The area is no longer what it is used to be. I always see police cars in the area and don't know if it is drug related or what. In my opinion, the area needs some money injected to provide more jobs, more opportunities and also more decent shops needed in west Ealing.If you like west Ealing, what is it that you like about it and if you could make any changes, what would you do.By the way, the idea to build flats on top of St John's School is so daft and dangerous and should be stopped.

Asha Smith ● 4653d35 Comments

Yes Thomas, really.I do agree with you that Crossrail will undoubtedly take a lot of weight off the Central Line, which incidentally will itself have new air-conditioned trains by then, and so this is often quoted as the scheme's main benefit.Crossrail will become a perhaps slightly faster, but inflexible way to travel into Central London, which by the time it reaches the less frequently served stations such as Hanwell and West Ealing, will already be crowded with passengers traveling from further out.Yes, I would use Crossrail to travel direct from Ealing Broadway to Liverpool Street, but it will not be a particularly attractive proposition to anyone wishing to travel from Hanwell or West Ealing to Westfield, Notting Hill, Hyde Park or Bank, hardly unpopular destinations.Changing trains between Crossrail and the Tube at any central London station will no doubt resemble the mayhem that is the Holborn interchange during the rush hour, where one often misses several trains due to overcrowding, so any time advantage of a faster first leg of a journey will be quickly lost.Regarding the apparent pledge by the Mayor that Crossrail fares to be "in line" with the Tube, it really amazes me that some people still believe politicians' promises, and then call it evidence. "In line" is specifically worded not to mean "identical" and faster travel will eventually cost more, if not at launch, then soon after.So no thanks, I'd rather continue getting a guaranteed Central Line seat direct to a much greater choice of destinations, within comparable time and comfort. And I'll pass on Crossrail and the associated housing hype, especially around West Ealing for reasons clearly described in the title of this thread.

Tom Carroll ● 4628d

Crime is dropping like a stone and has been since 1996.http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/crime-statistics/period-ending-march-2013/sty-crime-in-england-and-wales.htmlSince 1981 though it's barely changed.

Paul James ● 4632d

Reality and perception.It's the job of the authorities to work on both these aspects with regard to crime.Seemingly crime is on the down. However round the magistrates court in W Ealing at least, there is a massive cleanup to do.I think perception of crime takes quite a while to catch up with reality. Whether that's usefully measurable I don't know.It would be interesting to know why crime figures are dropping, especially as police numbers dwindle.

George Knox ● 4632d

Depends what you mean by 'better' - where I live the choice is generally between few mins walk from home to platform and a train every few mins on the Piccadily Line, or a bus to Kew Bridge (or a 20 mins forced march there or to Brentford) to wait for one of only 4 trains per hour, which may or may not turn up (all too often don't in my experience) to amble just as slowly (despite the far less frequently spaced stops) to Waterloo. Last time I elected to travel that way I missed an important business meeting at Clapham because the service, firstly announced to be delayed, was then cancelled altogether. And that's by no means the first time I've been messed about ny that 'service'.And I've no doubt the similarly infrequent Xrail local service will be similarly unreliable - if it isn't it'll be because resources are diverted to that service from other overground service for political reasons.

Chris Veasey ● 4632d

Oh dear, there's always one on here that gets close-up and personally abusive when contradicted.I read what he says in that, but look at the words closely - says it is INTENTION to...., not that he absolutely promises that.......He may honour his stated intention, if he's still there when it opens, but wouldn't trust him or any other slippery politician.But in any case the fare level, thouyg imoportant, is far less so than the demonstrable fact that Xrail services will only take a minority of punters where they want to go and will not do so frequently enough, particularly in this borough.And no I aren't 'bitter', just dissatisfied with the standard of public transport provision those responsible (and all too many easily-pleased punters) seem to think is good enough.  Transport is my lifetime job, and I know public transport even in London could and should be so much better.

Chris Veasey ● 4632d

A good result then - well done the Met.

Gerry Tan ● 4633d

>>Bud questions>>In June, a crime every 20 minutes . . .>>AH replies>>Surely not!  But, but . . . . according to the latest bulletin from the 'Thought Police', crime is going down and is at its lowest for decades!  LOL Crime cannot possibly be worsening.  But has anybody told Mr Joseph?  http://www.ealinggazette.co.uk/ealing-news/local-ealing-news/2013/07/17/northolt-man-jailed-for-knifepoint-robberies-64767-33622164/

Andy Horridge ● 4633d

Hmmm, that's depressing, so in the month of June, every 20 minutes there was a crime in Ealing.

Bud Richards ● 4633d

Not sure I get the difference between that and travelling to the last Central Line station in Z2 (Holland Park) and getting the bus from there.  The difference is in not entering Zone 1.  Vauxhall is, of course, somewhat closer in and with much better links - the Z2 thing is a handy trick I've used on occasions too.A more reasonable comparison would be on both lines to a Zone 1 station such as Oxford Circus, which is: - Brentford (Z4) - £5.10 peak/£3.90 off peak - Hanwell (Z4) - £3.80/£2.70 off peak (same as the Piccadilly from Boston Manor)Quite a difference.Basically the Ealing line gets a better deal now and, given that there's now an official undertaking that Crossrail will use the same farescale as now, will presumably have a better deal when the line opens, only it'll be considerably better to travel on.  Yet people are complaining.

Thomas Barry ● 4633d

Confused as to who is arguing what here but it is cheaper to travel from Brentford station into central London on a nice air-conditioned train than it is to take the tube.Brentford is in zone 4 for travelcards Vauxhall (wonderful bus service to all parts) is in zone 2 for trains but zone 1 for the underground.Return  fare is 5.80 (train) £7.60 (tube from Boston Manor).I used the service every day for seven years and SWT/bus is far better than the tube.

Nigel Brooks ● 4634d

"based on existing fare structure it is already more expensive to use rail services as opposed to the Tube,"Not on the Ealing Broadway line, it costs exactly the same, as they use the TfL farescale.  Other lines, such as SWT through Brentford, charge more because they've never had fares set by London Underground/TfL and use the National Rail farescale, which also charges a premium for people changing onto the tube at the London terminus."No doubt about that."You've got no evidence for that, have you?  I have."For that reason alone, Crossrail will not be significantly more attractive, if at all, to a less expensive Central Line train with better interchangeability, running every 2 minutes."Really? One's a cramped, crowded, non-air conditioned train that stops everywhere and takes an age to get to the centre, the other's a spacious, air conditioned train which is about twice as fast.  You watch what happens when it opens.

Thomas Barry ● 4634d

As expected, Crossrail fares will be set in line with LU/DLR. So there.http://www.mayorwatch.co.uk/mayors-crossrail-fares-pledge-welcomed/201326426"the same systen could and no doubt would operate on Xrail."No it won't. Stop spreading this nonsense, Chris, you clearly know nothing at all about the subject but have some kind of bitter anger about things that you bring to this forum in lieu of anything of any value.

Thomas Barry ● 4634d

The stats on reported crime are available in map format here http://content.met.police.uk/Site/ealingperformancestatistics?scope_id=1257246763809

Katharine Lang ● 4646d

You only have yourselves to blame

charlie bucket ● 4647d

Crossrail have not announced their prices yet, but based on existing fare structure it is already more expensive to use rail services as opposed to the Tube, so it is unlikely it will change.Regarding distinguishing between specific routes, if Crossrail can milk the paying public by installing ticket gates or employing ticket inspectors so that it can charge more for its services, then it will. No doubt about that.The greatest con here is that Ealing Broadway station will remain an overcrowded hub unfit for purpose, and the lesser frequency services at peripheral stations will lose their much trumpeted false attractiveness even if they afford journeys straight into Central London as any time saving on the actual train journey will be offset by platform waiting times. Punters will still have to leave the house much earlier in the morning, in case they've just missed a train, or couldn't get on one due to overcrowding, and subsequently have to wait another half an hour for the next one. For that reason alone, Crossrail will not be significantly more attractive, if at all, to a less expensive Central Line train with better interchangeability, running every 2 minutes.I agree that it will be convenient to use from Ealing Broadway, but anyone looking for a seat on nice, frequent, affordable Crossrail trains from Hanwell or West Ealing are deluding themselves.

Tom Carroll ● 4648d

"Likely to be TfL standard farescale.....Would be rather odd if they weren't, though, since there's no way for the system to detect whether someone touching in at Ealing Broadway and out at Bond Street had used Crossrail or Central Line." - the system similarly can't detect ordinasry standard-fare punters boarding premium-fare Heathrow Express or Gatwick Express - instead both are policed by very diligent and enthusiastic on-train 'revenue protection' staff who sting such punters for on-the-spot penalties - the same systen could and no doubt would operate on Xrail."The point about a 15 minute frequency service from West Ealing is of course that it goes straight into Central London, so is a good deal more useful than a 15 minute service just into Paddington" - that rather depends whether or not you want to go to/from  the very narrow central London corridor served by Xrail - most punters will still have to change to other, tube services or buses to get where they're bound for, and those interchange facilities (where provided at all) will be every bit as wearisome and inconvenient as most existing ones. Thus many West Ealing punters may well find it preferable to continue to walk or bus it to Ealing Broadway, Ealing Common or Northfields to get a much higher-frequency tube train to a much wider range of Central London destinations, rather than stand around on West Ealing station for up to 15 minutes (or much more if the Xrail train is late or cancelled). And what of Hanwell punters who will only have trains every half hour, even in the highly unikely event of the service running faultlessly?"attractive enough to create demand for housing in the area...." - oh great, just what the community needs - more house price and rent overheating and more overdevelopment and overcrowding  -  well worth spending all those squillions of public money on Xrail to achieve, eh?

Chris Veasey ● 4648d

"TfL isn't a mainline rail operator....." - but Xrail will run on mainline (Notwork Rail) tracks, except for the new underground bit in the middle, and outside London for much of its length at each end, so the mainline rail sector will stil have a big finger in the pie - and in any case TfL's continued refusal to have Piccadilly Line trains call at Chiswick town centre's station at Turnham Green except late night and Sundays (and except when a TfL/Underground employee wants to get on/off there) shows TfL to be infected with the same mentality."4tph direct from West Ealing to the West End and City is a considerable leap in provision by anyone's standards" - well it'll be only 2 TPH serving Hanwell, which is a complete waste of time - but even with 4TPH I suggest you try the lacklustre servie on the Brentfore/ Hounslow loop line from Waterloo, which has that frequency on paper but whose trains are all too often late or cancelled - as Xrail trains will be, without they're given absolute priority over other services in which case other travellers will suffer."Overground's likely to get an interchange station on Crossrail at Old Oak Common..." - well maybe, but probably not - and we can be pretty sure it'll be poorly designed and laid out on the cheapest nastiest basis even in the unlikely event of it materialising. And even if it does,why should punters have to wait so long for a facility which is needed now - in fact was needed long ago?"The main justification for Crossrail is congestion relief of the Central and to an extent Piccadilly tube lines" - Xrail will do nothing whatever to relieve congestion on the Piccadilly Line, and little if any for the Central Line. Whatever is claimed publicly, the REAL 'justification' for Xrail is to give senior bankers in the City and the Dogs a fast link to Heathrow - any other 'benefit' is incidental."Anyone complaining that Crossrail is a waste of money needs to address what you'd do ...." - simple -  stop and reverse this relentless overconcentration on expanding London, to the detriment of many of its own harassed citizens as well as the rest of the country, and develop the core cities and metropolitan regions elswehere, especially in the island's heartland - taking a lead by moving the seat of Government to metropolitan southwest Yorkshire or elswehere in the upper Humber basin - then Londoners will be able to breathe, and others get their rightful share of the cake for a change.

Chris Veasey ● 4648d

Jesus. Some people don't know how lucky they are:"I'm afraid it's entirely in line with the trad mentality of mainline rail operators in this country"TfL isn't a mainline rail operator, and will take over letting the franchise (as a concession).  I'm therefore not sure I get your point, or indeed any of your other points - 4tph direct from West Ealing to the West End and City is a considerable leap in provision by anyone's standards and Overground's likely to get an interchange station on Crossrail at Old Oak Common, although that'll be middle 2020s at the earliest.Even given that I'm not entirely sure I understand why better links to the admittedly excellent orbital service are better than a wholly new, fast link direct to the centre of Europe's biggest city, but perhaps your tastes are more Brondesbury than Bloomsbury.Anyway, that's actually academic - the main justification for Crossrail is congestion relief of the Central and to an extent Piccadilly tube lines.  Anyone complaining that Crossrail is a waste of money needs to address what you'd do with those two when they run out of room - the Central in particular can't reasonably run many more trains through the core.  I assume you've read the relevant TfL papers on the subject?

Thomas Barry ● 4648d

"but they are likely to be more expensive than existing rail services."Are they?  Likely to be TfL standard farescale, same as the existing line, Overground and the Tube, unless you have evidence to the contrary.  Would be rather odd if they weren't, though, since there's no way for the system to detect whether someone touching in at Ealing Broadway and out at Bond Street had used Crossrail or Central Line.Of course the TfL farescale's likely to go up a lot before then due to above inflation fare rises, but that applies to the existing service too if Crossrail didn't exist, so go figure.The point about a 15 minute frequency service from West Ealing is of course that it goes straight into Central London, so is a good deal more useful than a 15 minute service just into Paddington.  It is, in Z3/Z4 outer London terms, certainly attractive enough to create demand for housing in the area due to the speed and convenience of not having to change at Paddington.

Thomas Barry ● 4648d

Cannot agree more. Crossrail is likely to be infrequent, expensive and overcrowded. It will take a lot of pressure off the Central Line though, which is good news.http://www.crossrail.co.uk/route/surface/western-section/

Tom Carroll ● 4648d

We've got to be careful about people shouting it's becoming more dangerous, as others are ready to believe it is, then what the police are doing that is actually bringing  crime down is stopped as it's seen as a failure, when in fact,it isn't, it's a success.

Paul James ● 4651d

Found the knife crime statsNot great reading for Ealing by comparison to neighbouring boroughs.http://www.citizensreportuk.org/news/2013/06/25/london-knife-crime-offences-by-borough-2007-to-2013/

Nigel Brooks ● 4651d

It would be a poor average as I would venture to suggest that there are far more knife crimes in Brixton than in, as example, Notting Hill / Kensington.

Nigel Brooks ● 4651d

"1,000 knife crime victims in London each month, shocking new figures show".  Was the one of the headlines in the Evening Standard last week.  So if anyone knows the ratio of the population of West Ealing to the whole of London can work out an average.

Philip Coe ● 4651d

"Crossrail will run services from West Ealing only every 15 minutes at peak times, Hanwell every 30 minutes, and no-one has any idea about ticket prices to Central London, but they are likely to be more expensive than existing rail services"- Oh suprise suprise!! (if true - your source??) - I for one saw that coming long ago -  I'm afraid it's entirely in line with the trad mentality of mainline rail operators in this country to favour longer-distance and outer-suburban punters over the oiks further in like us - ideally (from their viewpoint) they'd love to close local stations like these altogether if they could get away with it  - so all the lemmings that hysterically applauded and supported Xrail - including our local political lords/ladies amd masters/ mistresses have been thoroughly stitched up, as they were always going to be.All those squillions of public money being sunk into this ludicrous megaproject - for what??Meanwhile the potentially REALLY useful London Overground orbital rail services remain effectively inaccessible to most of us outwards from Acton for lack of proper interchanges and connecting local train services - which could be provided for a tiny fraction of the cost of Xrail.

Chris Veasey ● 4652d

I don't know if West Ealing is getting more dangerous.  It would seem that the opposite is more the case. I've lived and worked in Ealing since the late 50s, in different locations as a renter and as a house owner and West Ealing was always a bit edgyer and slightly shabbier than the centre of the borough. I don't think its more dangerous than before - in fact I'm certain its not. And I have to say, the more I go to West Ealing the better I like it - its looking up(gradually) imo.

Gerry Tan ● 4652d

There is a law and order problem in West Ealing.It's just one of the important aspects of the centre of W13 that needs concerted action.Whatever you might feel about Crossrial it is attracting the attentions of developers. The new hotel at 67-75 The Broadway, W13 is being built because of Crossrail.The new developments at Green Man Lane and Sherwood Close will, over the next nine years, increase the local residential population by 1,400 residents. Also over 60% of these new residents will be home owners, whereas now over 60% are social rented tenants. These new residential developments are attracting new traders to the centre of West Ealing.Two other initiatives you all might be interested in are the possibility of setting up a Council backed Business Improvement District (BID)in central West Ealing. A BID has been operating successfully in the centre of Ealing now for seven years. The principle of the BID is that all the traders put money in a pot and then decide how that money should be spent to improve the trading environment. This could well come to fruition by May 2014.The other development is the establishment of a Business Neighbourhood Forum in the centre of West Ealing. This is a Government designated body which is a collection of traders, residents and community groups who are working together to create the legal spatial plan for the centre for the next 15 years. The West Ealing Centre Neighbourhood Forum is legitimised and authorised by the 2011 Localism Act. The forum is also supporting the local BID initiative. If you live, work or have an interest in the centre of West Ealing and want to get involved in improving the centre, please join the forum - it's free! Register at www.wecnf.org

Eric Alan Leach ● 4653d

No-one ever seems to mention the problems of over densification of urban districts.This seems to be the desire of Both Ealing and Hounslow councils who clearly have not learned from the over dense developments of the 1960s.This will be a ticking time bomb and quite frankly anyone who pays the over hyped prices here in Ealing must be bonkers as it's going to be like Hong Kong.Great for a short while but a pressure cooker of a place to actually live in full time.

Oliver Gregan ● 4653d

It has always been cheaper

Keith Iddon ● 4653d

True, but getting back to the original topic, it's cheaper for a reason.

Tom Carroll ● 4653d

Yes Tom but it is much cheaper to buy in W13 than W5 and it is quite easy to get a bus to/from Ealing Bdway to W13.

Keith Iddon ● 4653d

Interestingly, Crossrail will run services from West Ealing only every 15 minutes at peak times, Hanwell every 30 minutes, and no-one has any idea about ticket prices to Central London, but they are likely to be more expensive than existing rail services.It surely cannot have that big an impact on the area's attractiveness to commuters, seeing as outside of the station West Ealing will still remain a dump to be avoided after dark, and tube trains from Ealing Broadway or anywhere else served by Central Line across Ealing run 5 times more frequently at peak times at a significantly lower cost.

Tom Carroll ● 4653d

I don't know how long you've been around West Ealing Paul(or Southall for that matter) but I have lived in the West London area,(Ealing,Acton,Southall,Hanwell and Brentford)since 1977 and quite a bit of it all has gone down hill on skis in that time.Why would people pay .5m to live in W13...Crossrail..simples...

Keith Iddon ● 4653d

Not only it's dangerous, Dean Gardens et al, it's now also a dump.I don't understand why anyone would spend half a million pounds to live anywhere near there. Used to be nice though.

Tom Carroll ● 4653d

Is it becoming more dangerous?A few incidents make it easy to get that impression, but often its not the case in general.Looking at the stats for that area on the crime map it's been a fall year on year for the past three years.

Paul James ● 4653d