Forum Topic

Your waste travelling 100 mile to be burned!

Why can't this be done locally to provide recycled power?http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-22432435

Nigel Brooks ● 4712d24 Comments

Ash is a very small percentage of the total incoming bulk.

Tony Colliver ● 4704d

It goes down to Bristol to be incinerated because it is the simplest and cheapest way of disposal. The infrastructure is already thereOnce incinerated, there is still a large amount of ash. Shiploads in fact.The facilities exist for Biomass, ash and other waste to be either recycled or disposed of and much of that is shipped to facilities abroad who have those capabilities.If it were done locally the transportation of ash is almost the same cost as raw waste but more difficult as it is dust.This way it is always in a controlled cycle.

Michael Brandt ● 4704d

"Who is still putting out more than one black of residual waste a week?  Why?"Family of four, one black bag every fortnight and that's not full! I am no ecomentalist but I was raised not to waste and my (now adult) children share the same values.Loads of recycling though!Some waste will still need to be incinerated and it makes sense to use the incineration to generate energy rather than ship it down to the west country.

Nigel Brooks ● 4704d

No matter how "residual" it gets we will still have to have a means of disposing of it.Burning it locally (and, preferably, recovering the heat) seems a much better way than visiting our pollution on those in other counties.

Tony Colliver ● 4704d

We need to stop creating so much waste ourselves in the first place. We also don't want to build so many incinerators that we end up having to import waste to burn. Technology is changing (and improving we hope) all the time.Who is still putting out more than one black of residual waste a week?  Why?

Philippa Bond ● 4704d

Nah - the prevailing wind is most definitely very much from the west.

Tony Colliver ● 4704d

Oh good, I can read the headlines now "Envionmentalists claim ability to control prevailing wind direction".Accepting that we have to burn some waste then it is incumbent on ALL lobbies to work together to ensure that wherever incinerators are sited that they are as clean as possible. The problems around Horn Lane are anachronistic and due to an industrial site being sited right in the middle of a residential area.

Nigel Brooks ● 4704d

Of course, Ealing is also generally up-wind from Park Royal

Chris Bell ● 4704d

Good luck hugging the trees and the bunnies mate!I do think it is a bit churlish to expect the peeps of South Gloucestershire to suffer our PM2.5s though.I definitely think that it should be the case that any pollution "unavoidably" caused in this manner should be visited on those that created the rubbish in the first place - i.e. us here in West London.  it just doesn't seem fair to expect somebody else to take the bullet for us instead.Waves and solar, keen fan though I am of both, are not going to help with the rubbish problem now are they?

Tony Colliver ● 4704d

A good reason for not having them near us is that they emit fine smoke particulates, known as PM2.5s and would increase Londoners' already high mortality rate caused by air pollution. These are less than 2.5 microns in diameter and can be absorbed straight into the blood. Even the Americans realise this and have introduced more rigorous testing than we have. The private companies that run incinerators in the UK can bend the rules quite easily when it comes to mandatory testing for their efficiency. DEFRA has 62 stations across the UK that test for PM2.5s but none of them are near any incinerators!The up side is that with all the new proposed incinerators, the government will save money on land fill tax. And it will be a shot in the arm for all the government advisors invested in the schemes. Seriously though there's nothing good about incinerators anywhere. Even as a solution to disposing of waste. The solution is to stop producing so much of it.Why aren't we talking about sustainable, clean energy solutions. Waves, solar... Why are people so easily tricked into sticking up for these dirty businesses that are just provide easy ways for fat cats to line their pockets while we suffer consequences. I wonder if Cameron will be joining the huskies again next election to convince us that he cares about the environment.Can't we be passionate about stuff that won't kill us?http://www.kingsway-villagers.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/private-eye-article.pdf

Alan Anderson ● 4705d

Ha ha - short sentences are best! I can see how that one could have been better organised.I believe that the amount of residual waste being transported has fallen but that won't continue if the Council do not target the areas where no effort is being made whatsoever to reduce and separate resources that can be reused and recycled.

Philippa Bond ● 4705d

This is the West London Waste Authority's contract for residual waste which has been out to tender for yonks. SITA have now been announced as preferred contractor. SITA then announced they were about to go ahead and build the incinerator, permission for which they had won on appeal after South Gloucs had refused permission, the same day I think.

Philippa Bond ● 4705d

Granted, but nope, I still don't follow why we do not burn the stuff locally.After all, the truck movements being saved are not the ones taking it from the local doorstep to the waste transfer station in Brentford.If we burnt it there and then we could save a few train journeys as well.

Tony Colliver ● 4711d

It's quite simple, The waste transfer at Brentford connects directly to the mainline to the west. It's a direct link and saves hundreds of road vehicle movements through urban areas.

Michael Brandt ● 4711d

What will happen if I do?(I don't get over those parts at all to be honest - I spent far too much time here on the Ealing forum as it is already and I simply daren't open another front!)

Tony Colliver ● 4711d

Ask the same questions on the actonw3.com forum.

Chris Bell ● 4711d

My feelings precisely.So why ain't we doing it....?

Tony Colliver ● 4711d

It has been shown that if we burned all our rubbish,including the stuff we recycle,we would be able to generate 20-25% of our energy needs every year.The method of incineraation,called plasma gassification,has moved on leaps and bounds in the last couple of decades and it would make far more sense to burn everything rather than recycle and dump,both of which leave a sizeable environmentally negative footprint.The way the smoke from an incinerater is filtered has massively improved and the best way to store the depleted filts is to bury them onderground in molten glass as opposed to concrete.

Keith Iddon ● 4711d

I believe it was 'mothballed' when the huge incinerator in Edmonton opened. I have certainly seen no emissions for many years.

Nigel Brooks ● 4712d

Anybody know why the three chimneys which clearly serve some kind of incinerator operation at the waste transfer station in Transport Avenue remain largely idle?In thirty years I think I have seen some kind of evidence of them being in operation on maybe less than a handful of occasions.

Tony Colliver ● 4712d

As I said there are already two new incinerator sites planned in east and south London. It does seem strange that there are no facilities nearer than Severnside 100 miles away. As Ealing is one of the six councils (the others being Brent, Harrow, Hillingdon, Hounslow and Richmond upon Thames) to sign a 25 year contract to 'ship' waste to Severnside talk of the 'several incinerators' seems scaremongering on your part and overkill on the part of any plans if accurate particularly in residential areas.

Nigel Brooks ● 4712d

Limited capacity at those sites? Where in Ealing would you like to site an incinerator? Pollution around here is already high, and PS-10 pollution measured around Acton Main Line Station is already the highest in London, yet Ealing and Brent Councils have proposed several inncinerators for the north Acton, Harlesden, Park Royal, and Alperton area to receive waste from the whole of south-west, west, and north-west London. Please let us know the location of your "back yard".

Chris Bell ● 4712d

There are existing incinerators in Edmonton and Colnbrook and new ones planned in Beddngton and Beckton. Why we are paying to ship rubbish 100 miles or more baffles me.

Nigel Brooks ● 4712d

Because of local opposition to incinerators?

Chris Bell ● 4712d