Forum Topic

NHS directors have private healthcare

I understand that the majority of members of the panel that reviewed the areas NHS trust and those that advised them all have private healthcare arrangements.Was this made clear to the taxpaying public when they were appointed?

Michael Brandt ● 4776d34 Comments

Re    be able to get out alive again.          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  sadly, that is about right, due mainly to poor hygiene and staff who can't speak or understand English too well.

Tony Price ● 4773d

I wish I could agree.Unfortunately, these days the prospect of having to enter a hospital fills me with dread for fear of whether I will be able to get out alive again.

Tony Colliver ● 4773d

The point is very simple.I have no problem with people wanting to go private be it health or education.But it is exclusive in an age where in all other social matters we are being forced to be fully inclusive, be it race, culture, disability, gender, etc.Still the worst kind of division is that of class. or rather, the upholding of a perception of class.Take the bright and well brought up kids out of a school and what are you left with?  Removing the bright and more able removes the benchmark that others can at least try to emulate and compete with. Instead, everyone gets dragged down by the bullies and the wasters.Parents who care about their kids education naturally will do what they have to to get them well educated. Trouble is, those parents are also the most able to ensure that the school delivers and maintains standards. Without them it's left to those who kick up a fuss over their child's right to wear different clothes. They are not so vocal whenit comes to same child getting an E in Geography.Similarly the NHS needs those who really care and can do.The NHS is there for everyone and when it comes to the crunch it is there when the private care is not interested.When it comes to those who run it or advise it . They should be more than happy to have complete faith in it. Absolute.Therefore no need for a private heathcare package paid for by the client - ultimately the taxpayer.When one finds, again and again in this country, that the only faith placed is in the money they can make out of it and the career in doing such. It is wrong, almost criminal.If one lives by the sword you have to expect to die by the sword, this lot want to swing the sword about but expect someone else to carry it home for them and die for them.Sure we all know that the NHS gets abused by too many at the delivery end but equally galling is the abuse by those who purport to underpin this institution. It's the management consultants, pharmaceutical corporates, contractors, all of whom have a culture of milking the NHS handsomely.The whole thing is rotten and it has got to the point now that decisions based on no logic at all with no substantiation of experience to deliver a safe 100% excellence of service may cost many, you, me, uncle Bob, cousin Jane, your best friend, their quality of health or even their life.So I for one want this list published and a clear out of anyone profiting form such positions.

Michael Brandt ● 4773d

If you get seriously ill, Tony, then the NHS will deal with it. Serious is what they're good at. It's the lesser stuff -- things that keep people in constant pain or stuck indoors disabled without actually being life-threatening -- where they fall down.

Susan Kelly ● 4773d

Yes, but you can make that argument about anything - it just doesn't stand up as couched.Are you or I "parasites" for charging for our services?

Tony Colliver ● 4774d

Problem with that as a strategy is that it only really works if you don't get seriously ill - especially in the early years.

Tony Colliver ● 4774d

What are you talking about Tony? It has nothing to do with 'class warfare'(!) and it is they who are being divisive.What else other than parasitic do you call earning £100k+ from an organisation you are supposed to be improving but have decided is not good enough for yourself?They may be paying NI like the rest of us but they get a lot more out of the NHS than the rest of us do.

Keith Iddon ● 4774d

Exactly.The financial incompetence shown by the last lot is breathtaking.I am left completely aghast at the shortsighted political opportunism that drove the PFI fiasco.What the  bl**dy hell were they thinking?!?!?!?!?

Tony Colliver ● 4774d

They are not parasites.That kind of language is deeply devisive and has a whiff of class warfare about it.They pay the same amount towards the NHS as you and I.And nope, I don't have nor have ever had private medical insurance.(Though I did have my wisdom teeth done on my wife's BUPA insurance back in the mid-eighties when she was working fulltime for a large company.)Ditto for people that manage to afford to send their children to be privately educated as well.  There is a reason why they do it and it has everything to do with the quality of the education available in many state schools.It costs upwards of £110,000 (at 2009 prices) to put a child through seven years of private education.  Now that is what I call a sacrifice, and all whilst continuing to pay just as much as anybody else towards the state education system whilst consuming none of the resources!Despite that however, I have to admit that it does seem a trifle bizarre to have non-users of the NHS deciding its future.

Tony Colliver ● 4774d

All insurance is a rip-off. If you have spare cash then put it in a deposit account rather than paying premiums and then pay for your own private healthcare, if necessary.

Susan Kelly ● 4775d

Re: the sooner we get rid of this lot & put the NHS in safe hands the better!............. whos safe hands? I think you'll find a significant amount of the 'last lot' also have private healthcare and send their children to private schools

Marie Shelny ● 4775d

Re so what's your evidence to the contrary?             xxxxxxxxxxxxx so where Tony  is yours that what M B says is wrong. Where are you getting your  "facts " from?

Tony Price ● 4775d

Re so what's your evidence to the contrary?             xxxxxxxxxxxxx so where Tony  is yours that what M B says is wrong. Where are you getting your  "facts " from?

Tony Price ● 4775d

Re  just like we have private building insurance, private car insurance, private pet insurance etc          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx probably because nothing else exists!

Tony Price ● 4775d

Re    have they to make sure they work properly?              xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx probably why they don't use them!. Whereas the N H S is good, it could be much better, especially in the area of hygiene etc.

Tony Price ● 4775d

A friend of ours just stopped paying his private health insurance after paying in for the last 30 years! He started of paying about £50 per month but they wanted to increase it to over £300 per month! This was just for him, not the family.He actually only used the service a few times in all those years - seems like a waste of money!

Jean F Fernandez ● 4775d

And what right do they have to pass judgement on the quality of services the nhs provide if those services are not good enough for them? They are parasites.

Keith Iddon ● 4775d

"I won't divulge my source but I was passed a document this morning which lists all the names and the details of their arrangements. This list has come via a union source and is currently being verified"So basically what we have here is a load of Union originated propaganda which by your own admission is currently unverified. I was half thinking when reading your first post that this is the sort of nonsense that Unions deploy to obfuscate the real reasons for change and prevent a rationale discussion and your follow up post just makes me more convinced of that.

Tony Gould ● 4775d

I certainly haven't got any private health care and don't think that makes me foolish.

Susan Kelly ● 4775d

I have to agree with Nigel here, Gerry. If the people running the NHS and schools aren't using the services they oversee, then what incentive have they to make sure they work properly?

Susan Kelly ● 4775d

If you look at what private healthcare 'insurance' has done in the USA it's not difficult to see why Clinton and Obama have fought to reform their system.It has created a class of super rich healthcare groups and doctors and dentists who are no better than any professionals in the NHS.Everything in the US is superficial.But woe betide you if you succumb to chronic illness. Even the most well heeled fall into poverty.Like pensions and car insurance. It is a 'product' to make money first and provision is secondary and purely necessary as a marketing tool.And when it goes wrong like pensions. The client loses all.If all those who go private paid the same amount into National Insurance we would have a service second to none- without the fat cats taking the cream.And it is high time those who come to this country do not qualify for free treatments until they have worked and paid in to the system for at least 5 years. Their employers during those 5 years should pay and healthcare as they already benefit from using new arrivals as cheap labour.The maybe we won't be looking at such stupid and myopic cuts and all the spivs looking to line their pockets.

Michael Brandt ● 4776d

"One would  be foolish not to have some sort of private healthcare"But fewer than 1 in 10 people do (Mintel) and that number is falling.Your comparison with other forms of private insurance is fallacious as there is no state alternative I the sectors you quote. All who work contribute to the NHS without choice, you can choose not to have the other forms of insurance (save for car insurance where it is a legal requirement).So, are you saying that those fortunate enough to be within the 10% should be, allegedly, the sole arbiters of quality and choice of care for the other 90%?

Nigel Brooks ● 4776d

One would  be foolish not to have some sort of private healthcare -  just like we have private building insurance, private car insurance, private pet insurance etc.  That doesn't mean you don't go to the GP on NHS (which you have to to get a referrel to private treatment anyway as the insurance won't pay out if you don't)

Charles Campbell ● 4776d

I won't divulge my source but I was passed a document this morning which lists all the names and the details of their arrangements.This list has come via a union source and is currently being verified.In any case this should be clearly declared by anyone who is involved in the NHS. Which has not happened and why someone has taken a closer look.However, it is interesting that those making decisions and making money out of advice, will not be affected by any such impact of their recommendations or actions.And to not live or use those services preferring to opt out and go private is one thing but when involved in such a process is pure double standards.A bit like John Selwyn Gummer feeding his daughter a hamburger.

Michael Brandt ● 4776d

This is where because the the Tory/New Labour coalition with investment bankers we have little room for manouvre. If the Lewsham situation was resolved by the new hospital going bust what would happen? That is an interesting one for the lawyers. Potentially defaulting on all these deals could save the NHS but it may damage investment bankers and we could not let that happen???

Peter Chadburn ● 4776d

Michael - where are you getting your "facts" from?My understanding is that few / potentially none of the panel have private healthcare so what's your evidence to the contrary?

Tony Gould ● 4776d

The same Peter is true of Labour's nonsensical use of PFI to build schools. many of which will be well past their 'fit for purpose' date while they are still being paid for.

Nigel Brooks ● 4776d

One point made was about getting rid of this lot, however the real issue behind a lot of the problems we are sseing today is the madness of the last lot in using PFI to build the new hospitals and so forcing closures in order pay the over inflated bills. The current lot's spineless attitude in dealing with an issue that they highlighted whilst in opposition shows that the NHS now has to provide care for the Investment Bankers profits. God forbid Investment Bankers suffer!!

Peter Chadburn ● 4776d

Absolute rubbish.Those who decide the future of services for the majority should at least have experience of using those services.You cannot have real empathy with those needs if you are a disinterested bystander simply observing from a position of privilege enjoying benefits paid for by the very people whose options you are reducing and whose services you are cutting.On this occasion Gerry you are simply wrong.

Nigel Brooks ● 4776d

Michael, I had no idea of the financial circumstances of NHS directors and trust members. Does it really matter?Some people are able to afford private health, education you pay for, dining at silver spoon restaurants, exotic holidays, large detached homes(sometime two homes), buying cases of wine etc. So what?Others of us use state NHS, send our kids to local schools, guard our pennies carefully, etc.  So what?Life was ever thus. Some have and some have not. Tough.

Gerry Tan ● 4776d

As John Cooper Clarke wroyr'...the public merely die'.Talk about 'Let them eat cake'.

Keith Iddon ● 4776d

I've heard it said for many years, long before the present government, that lots of GPs have private health care, just as many state school teachers send their offspring privately.

Susan Kelly ● 4776d

Michael, that was probably the least suprising headline I have read for some time.Don't forget "we're all in this together"- if only!

Nigel Brooks ● 4776d

The sooner we get rid of this lot & put the NHS back in safe hands, the better!

Simon Bell ● 4776d