Forum Topic

More front than Blackpool sea front

I refer to the homepage story of the disabled woman, a pillar of the community on the surface ,who lied her way to massive undeserved benefits.There is no indication that the £118,000 she cheated her way to will have to be repayed to the exchequer.As she has two  properties I sincerely hope so.And then some.The fact that she has escaped jail probably has more to do with the fact that there are probably few facilities for the disabled in chokey,depending I suppose on the level of disability.She is a disgrace.

Keith Iddon ● 5089d49 Comments

Re  man who says he would vote for the BNP.               xxxxxxxxxxxxxxx    well now here is an interesting and revealing post, one made  for the sole purpose of  attacking the person of another poster and which adds nothing to the thread nor is in answer to something written to or is in reference to anything written by Knox. So what do we make of that, a person out for voluntary abuse, why?. Stalker? Also what is most revealing is the reference to my voting for the BNP, which is not exactly true but any such reference is years old. So, seems we now have another person on our hands who keeps notes and records on other posters for the purpose of dragging them up years later and for the purpose of what appears to engage in abuse to the person. Just so Knox need not tie me in with the BNP, which of course raises the question as to why he should wish to do so, I repeat what I would have said in that connection in that a vote for the BNP would be a protest vote, so also why should Knox wish to omit that aspect. Or do we know the answer.

Tony Price ● 5083d

This sarcastic stream of contempt comes from a man who says he would vote for the BNP.

George Knox ● 5086d

Re  bored  bored  bored          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx so be it, don't suppose many will lose much sleep over it  but let's hope Bored keeps us  on the edge of our seats with beautifully crafted posts. And I find it rather strange that Bored comes  up with  suggestions re late buses, cold eggs as the result of mass immigration, in fact the absurdity  of it  raises the point as to why Bored is  so much in support of mass immigration, Bored must fell a tad lonely in a country where the vast mass are much concerned re the effects thereof. Maybe Bored  should try to enlighten  people as to why they are wrong, like the Hodge woman suggested be done over Dagenham way a few years  back, but I suggest Bored consults with her before he embarks upon his mission cos she had to  do an abrupt about turn  when in fear of losing her seat. And I quote " "I don't think that in a multicultural society we should be telling people that actually you are excluded from this," he said."Our head of state has even recently spoken out in defence of the Church of England. I think that's not right in a society where most people don't identify with that."  So perhaps Bored would like to instruct Her Majesty where she is going wrong.    Perhaps Bored  would like to arrange for mass immigration of Europeans into say Saudi Arabia or Iran, where I am sure they would love it. No, now there's a surprise.

Tony Price ● 5086d

Along with Keith, I am leaving this thread.It has, like so many other threads, been 'hijacked' to further the prejudices of a poster who blames race for all the evils of the world.What next, the bus was late, blame mass immigration; my breakfast egg was cold, blame mass immigration?Bored, bored, bored.

Nigel Brooks ● 5086d

Re  If not then stop beefing and get over it              xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx your views, perverted as they may be as viewed by the vast majority of the population of this country, carry no weight as far as I am concerned and thus are of no consequence or interest, sorry.

Tony Price ● 5087d

I hope you don't think I was justifying it?

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

I'm leaving this thread now as I've never before heard such contrived and convoluted rubbish justifying an indefensible criminal act from some posters,one or two of whom I would give the time of day to as posters in normal circumstances.

Keith Iddon ● 5087d

Of course she didn't do it for charitable reasons.Just don't *assume* that she was coining it because the economics of property investment don't always work like that - that's all I'm saying.

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

As several million have immigrated into GB I suppose you have an answer for what you would do with them and how you would restiore the lands to the previous indigenous people as you call them.. If not then stop beefing and get over it.It is so boring and continues to confirm that you are a dodo instead of a man who can come up with sensible observations with which not only would many would agree, but also would result in sensible changes.But moaning as you continually do gains the sympathy of no one. Its what children do before they become adult.

George Knox ● 5087d

"dependency and entitlement culture we have now" - surely we've had that to put up with since the beginning of time, at least back to the Norman Conquest, discourtesy of our Lords and Masters - plus, in more recent times, the bankers, big biz boards and the upper echelons of certain other occupations - long before even old Labour existed.

Chris Veasey ● 5087d

Re  that you favour diversity          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx utter rubbish, my beef is the effects of MASS immigration and the wiping out of the indigenous peoples, their way of life etc, Southall being a classic example and an area which is not exactly covering itself in glory now facts are coming out. One may ask why those resident there have not blown the whistle on the shanty town buildings. Tower Hamlets ain't a shining example either.  Nothing would be more boring than NO immigration and I guarantee I have more  friends originating not of this country  than most people have.

Tony Price ● 5087d

So TP’s sneering contempt is no cause for offence.Reminds me of a line from Sheridan.“Wounded myself, in the early part of my life, by the envenomed tongue of slander, I confess I have since known no pleasure equal to the reducing others to the level of my own reputation.”

George Knox ● 5087d

Re  looking after a couple of houses on behalf of the bank          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  oh c'mon Tony, you'll be saying she did it for charitable reasons next. First time I have heard of someone buying properties so as to be charitable to Banks, that august body of well known public benefactors.

Tony Price ● 5087d

Re  They were probably well meaning      xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx    I  have grave  misgivings re that Keith as we read today they  fiddled the figures re young persons' unemployment for the last years they were in  power, in time for the last Gen. Election. So what re them can we  trust, remember the 1m jobs for British workers, 70-80% going to those from overseas. Not to mention the covering up of  the biggest deficit in peacetime history.

Tony Price ● 5087d

Not @ Chris

George Knox ● 5087d

Re    Offence is in the mind of the offended          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  Rubbish, initialy it must be in the mind of the perpetrator, and for a post that says nothing else other than abuse to the person, the post  can be for no other  than that, ie  personal abuse, especially as no other contribution made by the person. Stalker springs to mind. As to the other aspects of your post, how pathetic.

Tony Price ● 5087d

Not much evidence that you favour diversity

George Knox ● 5087d

Didn't say it was unacceptable, just novel to me - wasn't even sure whether it might have been a typo for something else. Even I don't know (quite) everything.

Chris Veasey ● 5087d

Re  completely novel use thereof.          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx    not in favour of diversity then?

Tony Price ● 5087d

"Watch out Tony, somebody will call you a 'troll' in a minute.  :-)":0)    Too old to crock and troll!

Tony Wood ● 5087d

Keith I think I have said very clearly indeeed that I am not condoning benefit fraud whatsoever. So I don't know why you asked your last question.Also we know from the report that she accumulated wealth. I am not questioning that. I simply say that an outsider is not to know the motive, because you cannot get into their brain. As TP says she probably did it to get income to pay for the care. But none of us know the motive and it is not right to make uninformed assumptions.It's the sort of thing that TP does all over the place which is why he gets attacked. The issue in this discussion so far as I am concerned is about compassion or the lack of it. You don't need to be a swoonining leftie to have compassion.

George Knox ● 5087d

> Who's to say what the long term effects of waking > up to another painful day of drudgery with no signs > of any respite.Sound just like life round my way!  :-)

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

Keith  I can only speak for myself of course,but I can't help thinking that there "may" be extenuating factors in this case that the Judge saw that we haven't.  Really neither factions should form rigid opinions without that evidence.  Who's to say what the long term effects of waking up to another painful day of drudgery with no signs of any respite. What I'm trying to say as delicately as possible is that the concerned may have been acting completely out of character,that's sort of backed up by the "fairly" lenient sentence passed.  Please don't stick political labels on me if indeed that's what you're doing,I really have no politics other than trying to be as egalitarian as I can. Ta!

Tony Wood ● 5087d

Yes, she is a cheat and a thief, but as I have tried to explain, it is quite wrong to jump to the conclusion that because she is looking after a couple of houses on behalf of the bank this means that she has necessarily benefited from significant cash flowing into her pocket.  On the contrary, in the early years (the first ten at least) it is quite possible that it means the complete opposite - i.e. reasonably regular flows of cash in the opposite direction.  Houses do not attend to their own upkeep, and tenants are by and large a demanding bunch I can tell you with stuff going wrong at a quite remarkable rate compared to that observed of similar equipment in one's own home.As a group "greedy" landlords are a much maligned and misunderstood group I can tell you.(Of course she could have been making some money out of the houses.  I'm just saying it is far from guaranteed, and the amounts involved are far from what most people, from a position of considerable ignorance regarding the full economic picture, frequently imagine.)

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

It is George in the sense that imo New Labour greatly encouraged the dependency and entitlement culture we have now. They were probably well meaning,but it really wqasa like putting a bunch of 5 year olds in charge.You sais earlier that no one could say that this woman was doing this to accumulate wealth.Well yes one can say this.She has accumulated wealth in the shape of 2 houses she would otherwise not be able to afford.It is crass in the extreme to say that she could not afford care when she has two properties.That is not hard to understand.It's a good job that all disabled benefits claimants aren't cheats too don't you think?If this woman was stealing to feed her family I would have more time for her.

Keith Iddon ● 5087d

No Keith this is not about politics.

George Knox ● 5087d

Watch out Tony, somebody will call you a 'troll' in a minute.  :-)

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

"an offensive post to the person from one who has not contributed to this thread"  Offence is in the mind of the offended,I *have* contributed to this thread,it might not have been what you wanted to see, that's why you're offended isn't it?"could well be one of a number nom de plumes used by persons solely to attack others and make no  constructive contribution to the content of the thread."  Well....I'll be in Ealing from the middle of next week,I'm perfectly willing to meet up with yourself and show you my Drivers Licence,if I'm not who I say I am I'll donate £1k to the the charity of your choice,if I am however, you will do likewise to the British Heart Foundation,if that's OK?"Why do such persons exist and also how or why are they allowed to exist on these forums."By such persons? Do you mean anyone who has a different point of view to you,and if so would you like us all banned from such forums,that'd be a bit draconian wouldn't it?

Tony Wood ● 5087d

Well done to those on this thread who seem to think it is ok for anyone,disabled or not,to hold themselves up as a pillar of society  and accept the plaudits and then lie and cheat their way to £118,000 that does not belong to them.You are truly keeping New Labour's torch alive.

Keith Iddon ● 5087d

No I didn't say her lifelong disability legitimised her action - in fact I said I was not necesarily condoning it.Nor did I say the fat-cats' far greater excesses excuse her - merely that said obese-felines surely constitute a far more deserving and worthwhile target (or series of targets), albeit a more challenging one.And what on earth is leftie 'swoon'?? - not a new word to me but certainly a completely novel use thereof.

Chris Veasey ● 5087d

Re  making the life of a severely disabled person more comfortable.          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx        I would anticipate the houses were purchased for their rental income, plus I am sure all aspects of the case were looked into and taken into account by the bodies affected thereby. And it was just a matter of topping up as far as costs were concerned over and above the amounts supplied by the State.  That the fact of their existence was withheld was  without doubt intent to deceive.

Tony Price ● 5087d

It was fair comment.

George Knox ● 5087d

Re  plumbed new depths even for yourself.        xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  an offensive post to the person from one who has not contributed to this thread, a post made solely for the purpose of abuse, so what does that tell us. A poster who rarely seems to make a post, could well be one of a number nom de plumes used by persons solely to attack others and make no  constructive contribution to the content of the thread. Why do such persons exist and also how or why are they allowed to exist on these forums.          As far as my compassion is concerned, it it less than 3 hours that I was told by a person who knows me well how compassionate I am!.         Back to the " management " desk?

Tony Price ● 5087d

Depending upon when the properties concerned were purchased there are times in the recent past when it has been possible to purchase a house with remarkably little or even no cash up front.Indeed, some deals even gave "cash back" of several thousands of pounds.All one needed to accumulate several of them was the basic get up and go to fill in a couple of forms.Rampant house price inflation will then have done the rest - leading to the situation inferred to in one of the posts above where one of the properties is to be sold at a profit sufficient to repay the debt to society.Secondly, it is perfectly possible to hold a house for several years and, without trying very hard at all, to make no profit at on it whatsoever.  Indeed houses suck money out of the owner at an alarming rate for the most part.  (Capital appreciation notwithstanding of course.) Thus the owner of the property enjoys no regular cash-flow with which the imagined champagne lifestyle may be financed.  Although obviously they are doing it for a reason - that reason being the hope (but not the guarantee) that the investment will pay off for them later (usually much later) in life and act as a bit of financial cushion for them in their dotage.Secondly, we don't know over how many years the lady concerned was claiming cash not due to her.  But (having established above that looking after a house or two on behalf of the bank that owns it does not usually lead to an immediate champagne lifestyle despite views held to the contrary by large numbers of people) I would venture that if it was over ten years or so then the sum of £10K or £20K pre year does not go very far in terms of making the life of a severely disabled person more comfortable.I do not make excuses for her, I merely seek to offer an alternative, possibly mitigating, perspective.  At the end of the day she still did wrong.

Tony Colliver ● 5087d

Yup George,I stand corrected!

Tony Wood ● 5087d

Correction.Sneering lack of compassion.

George Knox ● 5087d

Your lack of compassion is overwhelming,plumbed new depths even for yourself.

Tony Wood ● 5087d

Re  She said it was because care costs are so woefully inadequate,         xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx  so she promptly  goes out and buys a couple of houses! Yeah!.

Tony Price ● 5087d

No excuse to commit a criminal offence. That cannot be condoned. The money also will be repaid as always happens. That doesn’t always happen with company fraud and the overall sums are much higher than Benefit fraud. That is why the governments should focus much more on the City, etc.It is not for anyone to say that the money was stolen to accumulate wealth. No one knows. She said it was because care costs are so woefully inadequate, and who would disagree with that in our so called civilised society? I suspect the accumulation of properties was to pay for better care since as Chris says she is seriously disabled. Again that is no reason to condone because it puts a person most unfairly in a far better position than one who abides by the rules.To take with one hand and to give what she has to the residents of Ealing with the other hand is another private human tragedy. She has fallen from grace and so is confronted with the darker side of isolation and desolation. It is wrong to be so one sided by being so condemnatory about someone you may never have met. Stop piling on the agony. She has been well and truly punished.

George Knox ● 5087d

Re    imagine what that does to a person          xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx    what a load of tripe is that posting. The author suggests being born with a disability enables one to turn to crime legitimately. Rubbish, and the author overlooks the fact that hardly  any disabled persons  would dream of using their condition as a reason for committing crime, be it physical  or " commercial ". That this person does charitable work  would in my opinion require her to be exemplary in her otherwise affairs. She above all should know how to behave. And to excuse her on the grounds of " fat-cats " and their taxes  beggars belief, just leftie swoon and claptrap.

Tony Price ● 5087d

Chris,Get a grip on objective realitywhy don't you..This woman hardly stole food for her starving kids.She stole to accumulate wealth.I am not a greatly religiuos person but also object to the way you refer to Jesus.As you seem to think you are his spin doctor on Earth,ask him to tell you of the story of the impoverished widow and the rich man.I dislike intensely when people like this woman wear a 'cloak of decency' when underneath they are plotting and scheming.And they get an OBE.Hypocracy beyond belief.Stop blaming Uncle Tom Cobbley and all.It is premeditated theft and greed nothing else.

Keith Iddon ● 5087d

What drivel!As a disabled person myself who spent the first nine months of my life in hospital,I would no more think about defrauding 'the system' than most right-minded people. I also object to Jesus Christ being referred to in such a derogatory manner. Christ's fate was pre-destined.Anyway, back on-track, I had to go to appeal then independent tribunal to get  mobility allowance for a condition which was considered transitory and which is now classed as 'chronic'. I am stuck with it, that's the 'lousy' hand I drew. I don't have three houses or a publically-funded job to subsidise my allowance either.Being disabled is NO excuse for criminal activity.Of course, I don't condone the 'legalised' theft by commercial organisations and individuals either.

Nigel Brooks ● 5087d

Aint schadenfreude and self-righteous indignation fun eh?While not necessarily unreservedly condoning her actions, hows about considering the following:-What do you actually know about the woman and her circumstances? Did you know she has been seriously disabled from birth?Can you even begin to imagine what that does to a person, particularly in view of the pitifully inadequate support society continues to dole out to the seriously disabled?What do you think old JayCee, aka The Messiah, might have had to say about the matter and about your sort of attitude to it, particularly having regard to the seriously lousy hand his alleged Dad had chosen to deal out to the woman?'Let him/her that's baat sin cast first stone' as they say - I'm sure you would enjoy doing just that - wouldn't even need to bury her up to her waist in the ground first - she can hardly run away.Alternatively you may wish to direct your fire at some more challenging but far more worthwhile and deserving targets, such as then boards and executives of large commercial outfits that bribe and sweet-talk senior civil servants into letting them off billionsworth of tax; bankers and the boards of other companies that continue to get away with stealing even larger sums from the shareholders and from society at large through the legalised 'hand-in-the-till' that constitutes financial and company law and regulation; etc etc.All comes down to the difference between the law and justice - any overlap betwen the two is purely coincidental.

Chris Veasey ● 5087d

With interest I hope.How do you know this Ben?

Keith Iddon ● 5088d

I can tell you with absolute certainty that every single penny of the £118,000 plus costs will be repaid, subject to contract of the sale of one of the properties, by the end of June.

Ben Owen ● 5088d

Seems in this case OBE stands for Old Benefits Extortionist.

Keith Iddon ● 5088d

Agreed on both points.A few hundred hrs community service wouldn't go amiss either.

Keith Iddon ● 5089d

I really hope that ECIL will survive from any association with her criminal act.Equally, she should be stripped of her OBE.

Nigel Brooks ● 5089d

Apologies  should read 'repaid to the exchequer'.Writing too quickly again.

Keith Iddon ● 5089d