Forum Topic

Building Failures

Radio 5 Live - shortage of skills, training, retaining and inspecting.  The problems of the building industry and the lack of investment in quality.

Philippa Bond ● 154d16 Comments

It just shows how it is impossible to rely on those who should be able to be relied on.  Different Fire Officers will notice different things.  Self-closing fire doors can be irrritating but are very important.  If you see them not closing properly - make sure they are reported and attended to.  I have seen some really badly fitting ones.  Hopefully there will be some tightening of regulations and more people will understand a bit more about how and why there are regulations - and why all regulations need to be written really clearly.Compartmentation is also really important so that fire is contained and can't travel from one flat to another BUT when somebody drills holes to put another cable through somewhere and when there isn't firestopping because it has been missed out somewhere that too is a problem.  I remember seeing a  a fireman explaining what a shock it was to be arriving at the Grenfell fire as usually fires in tower blocks are restricted to a smaller area ie something like one or two windows for a lot longer.

Philippa Bond ● 144d

It always takes a long time for government to act, unless they think swift action is a vote winner. Usual reason is the donations from vested interests to political parties, and that applies to all parties not just the Tories.The catastrophic failure of a tall building has been known about for decades, there have been enough explosions and fires and collapses well before Grenfell. Yet we can come up with designs and finishes that are simply unfit for human habitation even in the 21st Century.

Simon Hayes ● 148d

Nobody has said that they didn't. There had been calls for years for the English Building Regulations to be updated and they never were.  The Scottish Building Regulations had been updated because I remember talking to architects who were working with both just after the Grenfell fire and they said how much better and clearer the Scottish ones were to navigate.  There had been fires such as the Lakanal one and and Coroners reports which called for action to be taken which wasn't. There was also a Dubai tower cladding fire.

Philippa Bond ● 148d

That happened back in the 1980s and 99s. Strange how no subsequent government of any colour thought it was wrong. Not even New Labour….

Simon Hayes ● 150d

Both the Building Research Establishment (BRE) which tests materials was privatised and Building Control was the subject of privatisation. There was once therefore once a greater distance between these and the client and contractor.

Philippa Bond ● 150d

One of the dangerous issues is that building 'regulators' were privatised some years ago. One of these private regulators 'signed off' the cladding which burned so quickly and so tragically at Grenfell Tower.

Eric Alan Leach ● 151d

"It was the burning of the regulations and red tape in favour of the developers by Govts which allowed this.  It increased the making of ££££s by developers or many developers until it went wrong." (31/08/24 14:38:00 Philippa Bond)In the London Borough of Ealing, this has been aided and abetted by Labour run Ealing Council. The Labour dominated Planning Committee, as well as the administration, just seem intent on meeting targets for superficial targets sake. The present council just seem to build death trap towers/rabbit hutched council tax farms just to feed money to the disingenuous virtue signalling top dog council nomenklatura. This also includes Ealing Democratic Services. Labour run Ealing Council do not seem to care about meeting genuine housing need. They seem to be wilfully inept. As they have failed to publish how many housing completions it achieved each year. Ealing are the only London borough not to have implemented the developer tax called the Community Infrastructure Levy (CIL). All this shows that Labour run Ealing Council are lackeys and running dogs for nearly any old developer. Maybe John Lewis is an exception for some virtue signalling political reasons that the Council has.

Anthony Hawran ● 151d

It was the burning of the regulations and red tape in favour of the developers by Govts which allowed this.  It increased the making of ££££s by developers or many developers until it went wrong.

Philippa Bond ● 151d

The majority of these Towers in Ealing & Acton are cheap, shoddy "throw ups", there will be LOADS of problems.LBE under Labour couldn't care less.  Workmanship, build quality and longevity are not important when Developers are dumpiong barrowloads of ££££s on your doorstep.We have a lovely Council.

Rosco White ● 152d

Nobody has said that this dire state of the building industry is news but it is a while since I've heard a phone-in from people who have suffered from it and who have seen what has gone and is going wrong with it.  There are still so many new buildings needing to be remediated.  The lack of trained individuals and onsite supervision has meant that there has been a move towards building off-site and then putting buildings together on site.  The reducing of regulations to save money and increase the number of buildings completed dangerously backfired big-time.  Interestingly regulations in Scotland were updated much earlier and were different and better understood by those designing and working on buildings.

Philippa Bond ● 152d

Have a look at this RICS report from 2019. Section 3 deals with profit returns.https://www.rics.org/content/dam/ricsglobal/documents/to-be-sorted/performance-metrics-required-returns-and-achieved-returns-for-uk-real-estate-development.pdf

Simon Hayes ● 154d

Profit for developers? I estimate the cost of building (plus contribution to demolition) the 2 bed flats being built at Hanwell Square (the old Wickes site) is around £300,000. They are currently on sale for between £370,000 to £620,000.I'm not great at maths - but wow what a profit.

Eric Alan Leach ● 154d

Not to mention the raft of overdevelopment of existing properties and the willing planning dept to ignore historic covenants. view lines and use of correct ambient materials.And when politicians say 'Housing' for whom where and why and above all the terrible spectre that it will be the same over dense crass, poorly designed modern hovels that permeate all over the nation.Billions will be spent, backs will be slapped, fortunes will be made but ordinary people will still be crammed in over populated rabbit warrens.

Raymond Havelock ● 154d

Orion Park, opposite Northfields station is unlikely to see the supposed affordable housing’ built before the end of the decade.All very well making the planning process easier but if nothing gets built it’s a waste of time.

Simon Hayes ● 154d

Griffin Park is far from the only site locally as overstretched developers either pull out or await better market conditions. Absolutely NOTHING to do with a lack of investment.Old BP station on Greenford Road,, meant to be a 10 storey+ block, only thing built is the crane.New block adjacent to Dean Gardens, essential car park lost, work halted.Old McMillan Bloedell site, work not even started.

N V Brooks ● 154d

That’s not news.What isn’t often mentioned is that construction companies expect to make around 25 percent profit on developments, hence the propensity to stack ‘em high and build them cheap. Look up minor material amendments to planning applications. It’s a misnomer, usually meaning adding several floors to a tower block.You will also see plenty of undeveloped plots around London, the old Brentford ground is a classic case. Planning permission granted ages ago, old buildings demolished yet not a foundation dug or brick laid. Market conditions aren’t right it seems.The new government committed to building 1.5 million new homes in the term of this parliament. The consensus is that it’s impossible given the reluctance of developers to actually get on with the projects already granted planning.

Simon Hayes ● 154d