Forum Topic

Time to Postpone Trade Talks with the EU?

It perplexes me that more people are not raising the obvious question of why we are intending to persist with reshaping our relationship with the EU, a path which will involve a huge amount of dislocation for our economy when the coronavirus is already causing this to happen. This doesn't mean rejoining the EU but postponing the trade talks and remaining aligned with the single market until we are clear of the current crisis. The massive demands that the talks will place on an already overstretched civil service are bound to create a range of difficulties.Our PM is not known for his work ethic but even a more conscientous leader would struggle to cope with the workload that will be placed on them.If we leave the EU during a pandemic we reduce the ability of our universities to work with other institutions in Europe to develop a cure.It has already been reported that outside EU institutions we will not have the same access to EU developed vaccines that hopefully will become available.We have over the past few days had ample demonstration how even minor disruptions to supply chains can lead to hoarding and shortages. If the pandemic is still an issue and any new trading arrangement interrupt the free low of goods, there will be far worse scenes in our local shops and many people will have to go without basic essentials.The notion that freedom of movement presents an extra risk during a pandemic has been thoroughly disproven with EU countries closing their borders to each other for health reasons.If you don't agree that trade talks should be put on hold could you explain to me what are the benefits which outweigh all the negatives detailed above?

Mark Evans ● 2059d27 Comments

>People, be fair, Boris was/is following the advice of The Chief Medical Officer and the Director of Clinical Something or Other, he is NOT making the decisions on his own.This is a MASSIVE assumption. Also the government doctors are just that. Government Doctors.Doctors in the NHS could be heard saying the opposite.

Paul James ● 2052d

Why not? I think it is important to remember it isn't actually the mechanics of the talks that are the issue here but the diversion of national resources at a critical time.We are all being asked to avoid non-essential tasks and it is not essential that the process of our departure from the EU sticks to an arbitrarily decided timetable.

Andy Jones ● 2052d

Major error in previous post: The whole of the EU has started a major ventilator drive and will relocate resources to each member state as their situation peaks.  They have generously decided to count the UK as a member state for this project despite our “do-nothing” policy.

Libby Kemp ● 2053d

The whole of the EU has started a major ventilator drive and will relocate resources to each member state as their situation peaks.  They have generously decided to count the EU as a member state for this project despite our “do-nothing” policy.

Libby Kemp ● 2053d

Actually Vlod is right, why not. However given that we are facing an economic and healthcare tsunami i expect that anything else is a side show for the moment. The correct time to discuss this is in June when a decision needs to be made. WE can see the position and i think that by then there would be a consensus that important work has not been done and so an extension would be logical.

Peter Chadburn ● 2055d

Why not?

Vlod Barchuk ● 2055d

Brexit negotiated by video? You must be joking.

Keith Iddon ● 2056d

There is no reason why the talks have to be face to face; we have the technology to do these things without being in the same room. Time to make use of it. The call to postpone talks is little but a ruse by the EU and remainers in the UK to delay full Brexit in the hope that it can be prevented from happening at all.

Vlod Barchuk ● 2056d

I have not seen anything about an extension. I am sure that it would be politically impossible to suggest that now. Maybe in June depending upon the status of things then. This is a healthcare and economic tsunami that will affect us all. I would expect that together with the EU and other countries we will have to develop a Marshall plan to rebuild the economy. It might be more difficult after a no deal. So I expect an extension to be announced in the summer.

Peter Chadburn ● 2057d

The Withdrawal Agreement with the EU says transition ends no matter what on 31st December 2020. The risk has always been that if no future trade deal with the EU was agreed in time we would end up with No Deal.This would be a likely scenario under the latest current circumstances and would no doubt appeal to many.The heartening breaking news today is that the deadline will be extended. Naturally this will allow Whitehall to focus on the pressing health and economic crises. Indeed, maybe adults are now taking over.

Paul Cronshaw ● 2057d

The trade talks will be cancelled anyway as the EU delegates need to convene in Brussels and with a blanket ban on all non-essential travel within the Schengen Area they will not be able so to do.

N V Brooks ● 2058d

Sir Patrick VallanceGovernment Chief Scientific Adviser and Head of Government Science and Engineering ProfessionSir Patrick Vallance FRS FMedSci FRCP is Government Chief Scientific Adviser (GCSA) and Head of the Government Science and Engineering (GSE) profession. His personal research was in the area of diseases of blood vessels and endothelial biology.Patrick was President, R&D at GlaxoSmithKline (GSK) from 2012 until 2017. Prior to this, he was Senior Vice President, Medicines Discovery and Development. He joined the company in May 2006 as Head of Drug Discovery. He was a member of the GSK Board and the Corporate Executive Team. During his period as head of R&D over 14 new medicines were approved for use worldwide, for diseases ranging from cancer to asthma and HIV.Prior to joining GSK, he was a clinical academic, Professor of Medicine and led the Division of Medicine at UCL. He has over 20 years’ experience of basic and clinical research, and was a consultant physician in the NHS. His research spanned from work on medicinal chemistry and structural biology, through to cellular work, studies in humans and use of large electronic health record databases.He was elected to the Academy of Medical Sciences in 1999 and to the Royal Society in 2017. He was on the Board of the UK Office for Strategic Co-ordination of Health Research (OSCHR) from 2009 to 2016. He is an Honorary Fellow at UCL and holds honorary degrees from Imperial College London, Glasgow University, University of York and St George’s, University of London. He was a non-executive director and board member for UK Biobank and a non-executive board member for Genome Research Limited but stepped down in taking up the GCSA role.Government Chief Scientific AdviserThe Government Chief Scientific Adviser (GCSA) is responsible for:providing scientific advice to the Prime Minister and members of cabinetadvising the government on aspects of policy on science and technologyensuring and improving the quality and use of scientific evidence and advice in governmentGovernment Office for ScienceHead of Government Science and Engineering ProfessionThe Head of the Government Science and Engineering Profession is responsible for:leading the science and engineering profession within the Civil Serviceco-ordinating and encouraging the sharing of good practiceworking with departmental Heads of Science and Engineering Profession (HoSEPs) to ensure that scientists are able to access the right professional skills and learning and development activities within their departmentsGovernment Science & Engineering Professionhttps://www.gov.uk/government/people/patrick-vallance

Rosco White ● 2058d

The man you quoted originally was Sir Patrick Vallance not Professor Whitty

Mark Evans ● 2058d

Professor Chris Whitty ("......Chris is an epidemiologist and has undertaken research in the UK, Africa and Asia.)Chief Medical Officer & DHSC Chief Scientific AdviserProfessor Chris Whitty is Chief Medical Officer (CMO) for England, the UK government’s Chief Medical Adviser and head of the public health profession.Chris is also Chief Scientific Adviser for the Department of Health and Social Care (DHSC), with overall responsibility for the department’s research and development, including the National Institute for Health Research (NIHR).Chris is a practising NHS Consultant Physician at University College London Hospitals (UCLH) and the Hospital for Tropical Diseases, and Gresham Professor of Physic at Gresham College.[NOTE] :-Chris is an epidemiologist and has undertaken research in the UK, Africa and Asia. He was Professor of Public and International Health at the London School of Hygiene & Tropical Medicine (LSHTM) before becoming CMO.Previously Chris was the interim Government Chief Scientific Adviser 2017 to 2018 and, before that, the Chief Scientific Adviser at the Department for International Development (DFID).Chief Medical OfficerThe Chief Medical Officer (CMO) acts as the UK government’s principal medical adviser, and the professional head of all directors of public health in local government and the medical profession in government.The CMO provides public health and clinical advice to ministers in the Department of Health and Social Care (DHSC) and across government.The CMO is an independent position at permanent secretary level.https://www.gov.uk/government/people/christopher-whitty

Rosco White ● 2058d

I have no time nor inclination to check that but fair point if true.What about The Main Man though, The Chief Medical Officer?

Rosco White ● 2058d

Britain's chief scientific advisor is a former pharmaceutical company executive who is not a virologist and was appointed by Boris Johnson. I am not questioning his integrity but he isn't likely to criticise his boss.

Mark Evans ● 2058d

That is behind a Paywall and I have no Subscription.My Googling, however, reveals:-Johnson's coronavirus stance defended by chief scientific ...Search domain www.ft.com/content/38a81588-6508-11ea-b3f3-fe4680ea68b5https://www.ft.com/content/38a81588-6508-11ea-b3f3-fe4680ea68b5Britain's chief scientific adviser on Friday defended Boris Johnson's decision not to immediately close down schools and halt sports events or to isolate the elderly in the fight against ...

Rosco White ● 2058d

The FT certainly seems to think he did — see article here.

Gordon Southwell ● 2058d

Do you have evidence it was Dominic Cummings who put forward "herd immunity"?I am no great Boris lover but it's important to be fair & accurate.

Rosco White ● 2058d

There will have been a range of advice from a number of experts as this crisis unfolded but what is clear that in the early stages Johnson was beholden to the dingbat notions of Dominic Cummings on herd immunity and therefore chose to heed the advice that most closely adhered to that foolish notion. Now with the publication of the Imperial College report the adults seem to have taken charge again. The cabinet of poodles hand picked for unquestioning obedience has to contain at least some people who will pull against their leash when lives are at risk. Cummings no doubt will argue that the process of realignment with the EU should continue as planned and Johnson may be so in thrall to him that he will argue for it also but no sane person would agree. The PM has shown an ability to act against the wishes of his boss for instance in deciding to proceed with HS2, so hope should not be abandoned.

Gordon Southwell ● 2058d

People, be fair, Boris was/is following the advice of The Chief Medical Officer and the Director of Clinical Something or Other, he is NOT making the decisions on his own.And the last thing I just heard is that there is now a change of tack based on the LATEST information available.His "reported" humour aside, just be fair.

Rosco White ● 2058d

Johnson, the UK PM, in an emergency conversation yesterday with manufacturing CEOs to ramp up production of life-saving ventilators, is reported to have joked that they'll call it 'Operation Last Gasp'.There's humour, there's black humour and there can be a time for both. There is no doubt that the UK has elected / chosen / ended up with a bumbling clown as leader and in this most crucial time of need, WTF next!

Paul Cronshaw ● 2058d

I strongly get the feeling we've not been following what other European countries have been doing because Boris wanted to appear independent.Big mistake.

Paul James ● 2058d

Let's hope that very soon a hold will be put on all divorce proceedings with the EU. This has to be a period when we all start cooperating and working towards a mutual, communal way to mitigate this immediate health threat. The UK will come through stronger if it works and cooperates with its major existing trading partner rather than insisting on imposing new rules, standards and conditions. The UK can still try to put a hold on being removed systematically from EU bodies that exist for the good of the bloc and its members.

Paul Cronshaw ● 2058d

The willingness of Brexit supporters to proceed with something so utterly destructive is quite scary.

Paul James ● 2058d

While I certainly am perplexed about the decision we have left the EU and the government has a mandate to reframe our relationship with that organisation.The question is, even if you believe this to be the right decision, is it in the national interest to press ahead with trade talks right now? We face a very nasty economic shock due to coronavirus and nobody is claiming there will be short term economic benefits from leaving the single market. The risk of a deep economic crisis is being presented due to an unavoidable factor. What would we all have to lose by not compounding that risk by remaining in regulatory alignment with the EU until the crisis had passed?

Mark Evans ● 2059d

Reading your post, I suspect that you have been perplexed by the decision to part company with the EU for a couple of years now and take every chance you can to get a little more perplexed by it.We are currently going through a health situation utterly unprecedented in living peacetime memory, and yet a handful of people are utterly determined to drag it towards their hobby-horse agenda, be that Brexit (for or anti), or a party political point. Covid 19 did not happen because of Europe, and did not happen because we chose to leave the EU.

Nick Goodliffe ● 2059d