Forum Topic

Exercise in hubris, not "flagship restaurant": "...Closure of Dickens Yard Flagship Restaurant"

For me the closure of Charlotte's Place in Dicken's Yard represents an almost inevitable result of hubris in refusing to accept CASH and I certainly NEVER regarded it as a "flagship restaurant" (Ealing Today: "Uncertainty After Closure of Dickens Yard Flagship Restaurant", no flagship endeavour would need to restrict its clientele to only people who could pay using plastic (credit/debit/charge cards) and to disallow payment using cash.Not only the idea of denying "access to cash" is distasteful in what is meant to be an inclusive development on former public land in the social core of Ealing, however, it lowers the tone of the business as the reasons for going "cashless" are to do with lowering overheads, no flagship biusiness would NEED to cut corners by disallowing cash purchases, instead it would show its power by accepting less economic methods of payment, that is quality rather than parsimony

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2186d22 Comments

The reason for their downfall was the absolutely appalling standards of the food and the service.we took friends there for a meal once and were embarrassed at every turn.They started as they clearly meant to go on by taking an absolute age to serve us a drink at the bar.Every single course that was served had some kind of a problem with it and one or other of either our or our guests plates had to be returned to the kitchen.They did not possess a single brandy glass and despite having been given a heads up not to warm the glass or to serve it on ice (an observation that I had learnt the hard way it can be wise to pre-empt with) they took three attempts to get it right.  We were treated with disdain by the allegedly French head sommelier when we queried the absence of a stock of brandy glasses.  I say allegedly because, surely, nobody claiming to be French and in the sommelier  business would be unaware of the normal etiquette in this regard.Even the coffee was cold and had to be returned (twice!) before we gave up trying and simply put up with the tepid and insipid offering.In the end 100% of the food element of the meal (4 people, three courses apiece) was not on the final bill but the fulsome apology from the (remarkably young) gentleman that introduced himself as the general manager at the end of the evening, whilst sincerely and very professionally delivered, did not compensate for the horrors visited upon us earlier in the evening.We have never been back.I suspect that we were far from alone in this.Much more damaging to a restaurant than refusing to take cash.What a shame that Charlotte's Place on the common closed down.  Over the years we had many good meals there.

Tony Colliver ● 2174d

There are of course those who are stridently against buying anything on credit but presumably have nothing against debit cards. There are also a few people who are unable to secure either from the banks because of poor credit ratings - but are they likely to be dining out at such an establishment?  And there are those that prefer to use cash for anonymity, legal or otherwise.I know of at least one store in Westfield that has gone cashless for reasons of "staff and costumer safety".In all I suspect that going cashless was not the reason of Charlotte's downfall. 

Philip Coe ● 2181d

Did you ever eat there?Unfortunately the concept was changed often as they tried to find a formula that worked. Eventually the business failed as the food and frequently the service were simply not good enough.To think failure has something to do with a card only policy is naive.Did you protest when the typewriter came along and led to less handwritten letters? How about word processing software on PCs replacing the typewriter? Do you refuse to have a mobile phone and still use a rotary dial home phone? Do you cook on a fire or with a job and an oven? You get my point. We move forwards, the way we do things evolves. I am sure you have a debit card. Principled arguments about change which defy logic are simply a denial of progress. Try paying with your smart phone - it’s refreshingly easy.

James Putland ● 2181d

I looked into the concept of legal tender a few years ago and it's relatively complicated. My understanding is that if a retailer in England is offered £1 or £2 coins or £5, £10 or £20 notes in settlement, they are not compelled to take the money but the "debt" is considered met if they don't.If they do take cash, they're not obliged to give change.I don't know what would happen if a customer tried to pay with cash having agreed to pay by card before ordering.

Phil Kay ● 2181d

'Legal tender' is a concept based on paying a debt. It does not prevent any shop from rejecting a payment in cash.

N V Brooks ● 2181d

I thought cash was ‘legal tender’ here and as such could not be refused in payment.  Has that changed too?

Frances Zammit ● 2181d

Nicely said Mr Brooks. New establishments usually try and encourage custom with introductory offers I just recall two-fingers if you tried and paid in cash

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2184d

Do tell us more about the thongs, Bob.

Susan Kelly ● 2184d

Given the prices that Charlotte's used to charge for their far, 'coin handling' would be the least of their worries.
They were probably concerned that no-one could or would carry enough cash to pay for their, IMHO, over-priced bill of fare.

N V Brooks ● 2185d

Although the danger element of cash payments is a valid one, there is also the health aspect to consider as well. Cash money is a very dirty and unhealthy way of carrying out a transaction, especially coins with their rough surfaces which are a breeding ground for bacteria.For many years my late Grandmother was a clippy on the old Route Master buses and she suffered from appalling dermatitus which she caught from handling coins all day.Money is often in circulation for many years and you never have any idea how many people have been handling cash before you before you receive it, and you can bet your life no one has bothered to clean it along that journey.Now that I think about it I would'nt want to handle cash any more than I'd want to wear another man's boxer shorts, although my wife has some very pretty thongs that fit me perfectly. Still, maybe I should leave that subject for another thread.

Bob Little ● 2185d

Not having to take cash to a night safe or being held up at gun point is a benefit to employees.  As all state benefits are paid into some form of a bank account, almost all have a cash card.I also tip in cash direct and remove from the card payment. The way.

Libby Kemp ● 2185d

Libby,You explain the economics of the card only restaurant and the benefits of its operation to the owners and operators very well (many of the arguments apply to other types ofbusinesses as well), however, is cashless only something that the public will buy, or tolerate?And is it even moral in terms of "access to cash" by excluding whole swathes of society - I think not! Too many busineses go bust because they try and tell the customers what to do instead of listening to the customers and providng them with what they want to buy. It is no good having this super efficient restaurant money making machine if no one wants the product, better to remain in business and make less profit than to go bust by not listening to your customers.Oh, and the owners love card only because it makes it much easier to make sure that the tips stay in the owners pockets being given on the card payment rather than as a cash tip. When I tip I always tip cash and ask to have the tip removed for the card payment. Way too many establishments share the tips with the staff other than the waiters and waitresses wrongly treating them as part of their salary and even take a percentage (or all of the tips) themselve. If you cannot tip in cash you CANNOT be sure that the person that served you is getting anywhere near the the tip (or all of it) even then who knows what pressures are applied behind the scenes

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2185d

To take only card payments especially in managed restaurants has many plus points, especially for the employees. It has cut down armed robberies, burglaries, the need to have a safe and helps keep insurance down.  It also saves staff having to take monies to a night safe, if banks still have them?, staff running the risk of being attacked and in some towns, it required three staff, that is three extra hours payment every night. Would any of you like to take thousands of pounds to a bank after midnight?  The nightly use of bank night safe was dangerous and expensive, as is the cost of depositing cash.  It is also easier to keep track of takings and makes book keeping far easier. The use of two card machines at Portico is just the modern way of pocketing some of the cash, which is quite common in small businesses and far more difficult with card machines.

Libby Kemp ● 2185d

'It is all too easy to let spending go out of control when only using a credit or debit card.'I have never found this to be the case and I've had a credit card since turning 18, which was a very long time ago.However, I think people should have the option of paying cash.

Susan Kelly ● 2185d

Note how the title of this thread has NOT been texted out as a Topic on on Ealing Today Twitter, stand up for Ealing Residents, ecology, sustainability and the future, NOT keeping the developers and these awful Make It Ealing people happy!

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2185d

We MUST defend the use of and continuing existence of cash.Those who condone a "Cashless Society" really have not thought it through, do you REALLY want the Banks and Government to have ultimate control over your money and spending?Won't ever happen? Tell that to the Cypriots.

Rosco White ● 2185d

It is becoming ridiculous that some shops refuse to let customers pay by cash! I would not shop in any business who thinks my money is not good enough for them!I heard recently that in New York shop owners are no longer allowed to refuse cash paying customers, perhaps they should do the same here!It is all too easy to let spending go out of control when only using a credit or debit card. Personally I prefer to use CASH unless ordering online.

Jean F Fernandez ● 2185d

Libby,In the HOSPITALITY INDUSTRY which is a SERVICE industry  the idea of accepting multiple form of payment is to attract the broadest range of customers and to retain their CUSTOM (ie. to get the accidental visitor to return and to make it their CUSTOM to return and hence be a CUSTOMER). Restricting payment methods restricts customer options and reduce the level of SERVICE provided hence making the establishment LESS HOSPITABLE. Hence enstablishment that are not HOSPITABLE go out of business, c.f. Charlotte's Place. Gettimg rid of cash reduces your overheads, however, also REDUCES your customer base. Reduced overheads due to no cash equals reduced customers who want to pay by cash which equals closure.So, how to go bust in the service and hospitality industries is to be inhospitable and provide poor service, i.e. do not take cash.Admittedly (tongue-in-cheek) card technology does provide novel options for fraud as has been demonstrated by one restaurant owner recently, as reported in Ealing Today recently:  "The owner of Osteria del Portico in Ealing Green has been jailed after admitting to using a secret card reader to evade tax.Giovanni Balboni, aged 59 from Loveday Road pleaded guilty to taking payments and under-declaring how much he charged.He evaded £303,427.30 VAT due on sales of more than £1.8 million. He has been sentenced to 30 months in jail at Isleworth Crown Court today (23 October)."Also, in light of "ACCESS TO CASH" I find card-only establishments immoral in denying access for people who do not have cards, or do not want to have cardaThese businesses are there to part me from my cash and provide me with service that I want, I am NOT there to provide with "card" money.

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2186d

There are a number of very good reasons why restaurants are card only - think about it.

Libby Kemp ● 2186d

Well said sir! The Charlotte's "Group" did a lot of marketing and PR, it was certainly big in the Ealing "e-space". however, artificed image does not always  translate into reality, and the company (by that I mean the orther organisations it "marketed" with) that the "group" kept in the "Twitter/Facebook/..." e-space left much to be desiredThere is I believe another "card only" enterprise in Dickens Yard and it will be interesting to see how long that lasts

Mark Julian Raymond ● 2186d

I boycotted them years ago when they were trying to charge the same price for a place at Christmas lunch as Crisis wanted to feed, clothe and health-check four people at one of their shelters.
The whole group appears to have gone kaput. The Ealing Common original never recovered for a 'gas explosion, the the 'bistro' in Chiswick closed and now the 'flagship'.
I have to say "so what", there will soon be someone along to take their place.

N V Brooks ● 2186d

I boycotted them years ago when they were trying to charge the same price for a place at Christmas lunch as Crisis wanted to feed, clothe and health-check four people at one of their shelters.
The whole group appears to have gone kaput. The Ealing Common original never recovered for a 'gas explosion, the the 'bistro' in Chiswick closed and now the 'flagship'.
I have to say "so what", there will soon be someone along to take their place.

N V Brooks ● 2186d