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Missing building South Ealing Road?!?!

I was shocked this morning to see the building next to St Mary's Road car park demolished and cleared away seemingly overnightI thought that building was listed as once part of a Victorian fire station or something?Maybe I have the wrong building but I do know the roof there leaked like a sieve and the former Polish shop didn't fare well....maybe because there's 7 in a 500 yard stretch of road So more flats I suppose are the order of the day??

Colin Goodman ● 3894d32 Comments

Don't forget to wash it all down with a bottle or two of Blue Nun, or for the more sophisticated, bottle of Asti

Chris Edwards ● 3878d

Derek Hooper explainedSeeing Perceval Hse mentioned earlier , the site was previously occupied by Southern Electric on the corner and Kenning Car Mart next door , the vehicle sales showrooms fronting Uxbridge Rd ....Thanks for that. I always remember the Car Mart logo, or sign as it was then, as it's a similar script to that of Coco Cola. (Says he, having just googled up a photo of CM HQ to be sure.) I also remember the electricity board showroom on the corner and both were clearly much smaller than I remember them, although an adult, at the time.Maybe I simply wasn't paying sufficient attention.michael adams.. 

Michael Adams ● 3878d

Seeing Perceval Hse mentioned earlier , the site was previously occupied by Southern Electric on the corner and Kenning Car Mart next door , the vehicle sales showrooms fronting Uxbridge Rd with the repair workshop and service reception behind. The land extended to the railway line and comprised more buildings including the workshop/retail stores . Along the railway boundary was another (small) workshop and bodyshop/paintshop. The customer car park and reception was accessed from Longfield Ave and the showrooms from Uxbridge Rd. There was another entrance further up Longfield with a small building on the right(of the entrance not the road) which was an admin office I believe. This entrance could be used to access the stores. I think it was closed by 1974ish and the business relocated to the Western Ave next to the Western Public Hse (now Homebase). The Austin dealership had been Car Mart but was bought by Kennings and became an Austin/Morris dealer as Kenning Car Mart, ending as a British Leyland and Jaguar dealer. I was an apprentice there from 1968 to 1973 - happy days!

Derek Hooper ● 3878d

Ah the memories of prawn cocktail, followed by steak'n chips with tinned bright green peas, then Black forest gateau - I thought I was 'the bees-knees' in the 60s! Also, canapies at a party of pineapple and cheese skewered on a toothpick! Such sophistication! Such innocence!

Gerry Tan ● 3889d

Never been in the Bell, or its current incarnation.I remember the Feathers originally had the Berni Inn at the back of the ground floor, and a small bar area at the front.Later the Berni Inn moved upstairs and both it and the bar area which was still downstairs became much larger.I also remember the Rummer Tavern (I think) which was across the road where the Halifax bank is now. It was either a Schooner Inn or a Heneky Inn, I can't remember which.Again a very small bar at the front, with a dark and cavernous eating area behind.Prawn cocktail, steak and chips (with those suspiciously luminous green garden peas) and of course Black Forest Gateau to finish with. The height of decadence!

Dave Hawley ● 3889d

I have fond memories of The Feathers and The Bell.  Speaking of Bernie Inns, I remember the fashion for eating out at The Bernie - prawn cocktails etc...ha ha ha!

Gerry Tan ● 3889d

Dave Hawley pointed out:...I remember when it was a Berni Inn!Had many a good Sunday roast there back in the 1980s.At least they did a good job in preserving the building, the interior of the bank is really quite impressive....Indeed. But there'd been a pub or inn on that site called "The Feathers ", for at least the last 250 years.By 1746 there had been little building south of the church, except a boys' school in South Ealing Road, but houses stood on either side of St. Mary's Road, those at the northern end facing each other across Ealing green. There was a pond on the green near the entrance to Mattock Lane, Maddock Lane in 1766, south of Ashton House or its forerunner. The village was extended still farther north by some buildings at the corner of Uxbridge Road. The high road itself was almost empty, apart from the Feathers and, to the east, the Bell.http://www.british-history.ac.uk/vch/middx/vol7/pp105-113Which like the two Old "Hattes" in West Ealing functioned as coaching and livery inns for all the passenger and freight waggons using the Uxbridge Rd.However as soon as some marketing oik decided to change the name, anyone reading about the "Feathers", unless they looked up at up to the gable at the top of the building on the corner wouldn't realise that that indeed was the site of the 250 yr old "Feathers" coaching inn. Same as the second of the Old Hattes which changed to the "Half Way House" when the toll booth was removed. That's still named on the gable. While the other Old Hat became Flynn's and god knows what else.Clearly the argument was lost, as soon as these places became uneconomic as pubs or gastrorestaurants. It's just the thoughtless way they were renamed, without a thought for the break in continuity.I remember "the Bell" kept its name even when just the ground floor of an office block, but is now the "Lodge Tavern". michael adams...

Michael Adams ● 3889d

I remember when it was a Berni Inn!Had many a good Sunday roast there back in the 1980s.At least they did a good job in preserving the building, the interior of the bank is really quite impressive.

Dave Hawley ● 3889d

"Arboricultural..."In what way does the planning permission pertain in particular to trees I wonder...?

Tony Colliver ● 3891d

Terry Freestone asked:The Feathers"? You mean MetroBank?It was first renamed "The Town House".Quite possibly if they'd left the name as it was,they wouldn't have alienated their existing customerssuch as they were, to the extent that they had to close it down altogether. michael adams...

Michael Adams ● 3891d

Terry Freestone kindly explained :"77 Uxbridge Road was demolished in January 2010 with hardly a peep."Thanks for that. I was afraid someone was going to point out it had been demolished as long ago 1986, or some such date. (I normally take the "scenic route" between Ealing Broadway and West Ealingvia either Mattock Lane and or Walpole Park)  He then went on to explain:"As for Perceval House, after 30 years I've gotten used to it now."IMO anyway, Perceval House would be fine as acentrepiece in the middle of say a ten or twenty acrelandscaped office park, complete with a lake etc. Where the interesting profile of its exterior could be best appreciated from a distance. As it is, the treatment is totally out of proportion to the  site.* As I approached it from the West Ealing side I didn't really pay much attention to the effect the building on the West side was having on Longfield Housemichael adams * Which I subsequently remebered was at one time occupied by a single story building formerly housing "The Car Mart", and then latterly an Electricity Board Showroom. If my memeory is correct.

Michael Adams ● 3891d

Having seen the plot again this morning I think the value part of my reply may be a tad ambitious even by Ealing house price standardsStill a nice little earner

Colin Goodman ● 3891d

Thanks Philip - I missed seeing Simon's helpful post - thanks again.

Gerry Tan ● 3891d

"The Feathers"? You mean MetroBank?77 Uxbridge Road was demolished in January 2010 with hardly a peep. As for Perceval House, after 30 years I've gotten used to it now. Actually that strange empty building on the *other* side of Longfield House more disturbing,. What is going on there? Should have opened a couple of years ago.

Terry Freestone ● 3891d

Gerry. Post by Simon Wycombe 16:25 yesterday has more detail.

Philip Coe ● 3892d

Mark Kehoe suggested -"It was though, a viable small industrial unit the type of which is almost extinct in the whole district."In fact if you walk through the adjacent car park, or even better take a look at the Google Maps satellite view, you'll notice that there are two largesheds across from the back garden which abuts the south side of the car-park, which togetherare bigger in area than the former Douglass shed.I've often wondered how access was gained to these sheds other than between the houses, and for thatmatter what they are used for.Again equally instructive from the satellite viewIMO is the fact that the former Douglass shed abuts right up to the yards - there doesn't seem enough room to qualify as a "garden" even for the most optimistic estate agent, of the dwellings on the South Side of St Mary's Square. Now quite whether the residents of those houses would welcome an industrial unit a few feet away from their kitchens and living rooms is another matter. Presumably when the building was in use as a laundry ,the tenants, as they probably were at the time, had no say in the matter, as to what went on there.But times change.    I've got nothing against preserving local history at all. IMHO, marketing executives of the type who thought it a good idea to rename "The Old Hat"and "The Feathers" should be subject to sharia law type penalties. Their pony tails shouldbe cut off, for a start. Such is the impact on continuity for anyone engaged in historical research, for some totally spurious hypothetical benefit. (The fact that all pubs have come under financial pressure as result of the freeing up thesale of alcohol is another matter)  Similarly I noticed the other day that the last of the original villas of the type which formerly lined both sides of the Uxbridge Road has now gone.It may have gone some time ago as I seldom go that way nowadays. While not of particular architectural interest in itself, it was a last link to a former age. So a shame it had to go. Whereas Longfield House, so redolent of the 1930's is now totally dwarfed by the Perceval House excrescence plonked next to it. All given the nod no doubt, by a well meaning bunchof philistines with absolutely no sense of scale.michael adams...

Michael Adams ● 3892d

So, what's going to be built on this important site?  Where does one find out this proposed planning and development of sites please?

Gerry Tan ● 3892d

Who suggested preserving the building?It was though, a viable small industrial unit the type of which is almost extinct in the whole district. The sort of place that a lot of businesses are struggling to find and struggling to keep.  I know of one business which has been searching for exacly this type of place and the MD was gutted when I told him it was now no more. That would have brought 24 jobs into Ealing. This led to another discussion.Several of my peers that I went to school and college with have all now been forced out of operating locally as it is simply unviable. Costs are sky high and pressure from developers too great with very little help to retain the businesses locally. They have all moved right out of Greater London, Bracknell and Woking to name two.It may be small potatoes but those few business owning friends employed around 35 people - all locally. Not all businesses are purely office based and not all are retail, but space to operate anything other than such is rapidly being hived off.There seems to be a lack in some quarters of understanding of any occupation or business outside of the 9-5 office/retail culture.The gamut of commerce is far wider ranging.As far as my local map dating from the Heritage Quarter inception, This building is (was) on the very boundary of the conservation area that Includes St Mary's and in the heart of the Heritage Quarter ( which is not constrained by conservation regulations.)Democracy in this case would have been for this to be at least discussed and brought to the attention of the conservation panel, and the regular ward meetings.While time might be up for this building, which is sad given it's historic nature. Ensuring it's replacement and change in use is suitable for this sensitive area appears to have been ignored and not made open to residents.This is a real example of why not posting planning notices on lampposts and to local residents & resident groups is a retrograde step.

Mark Kehoe ● 3892d

The fact remains that the existing building was uneconomic to maintain. Nobody it seemswas willing to buy it and bring it up to a usable state.The only alternative, so at preserve "democracy"therefore, presumably would have been for Ealing Council to buy the building on our behalf, spend tens or hundreds of thousands of pounds ,knowing the way these things turn out, of Council Tax payers money in restoring the buildingand turning it into a heritage museum of some kind - which would probably close down for lack of interest within a year.It's exactly the same problem as faces the smallmansion in Gunnersbury Park. On the one hand everyone is up arms about preserving our heritage - or at least Lionel Rothschilds'heritage - but are not quite so willing to pay out the necessary millions to maintain a buildingfor which there is no longer any obvious economic use. More especially when prospective tenants can find satisfactory premises elsewhere, without incurring the wrath of potential objectors.michael adams

Michael Adams ● 3892d

£4 million value then.Buy the former building / site for what say £800kFees and the like £50kBuild cost £750kOther disbursements £100k (generous figure there)All up £1.7millPre-tax profit £2.3millNice bit of work, and yes, I am jealous!Hearing this isn't a listed building or one of historical importance means this sits easy with me and in fact it probably helps ensure the former building doesnt simply sit there and dilapidate further. I would however hope the houses are built in sympathy with the area and parking considered. It's good a "high density" development not being progressed, ie I expected a block of 12 one bed flats. Fitting 4 houses on that site will take some doing though.Good luck to the developer and I hope they do a good job.(BTW -- Conservation Area? Really? New one on me that - if so then surely high consideration of the "in sympathy" design must've been made???)

Colin Goodman ● 3892d

In a conservation area, and not a word or a single notice, no-one local seems to have heard a word on this.Whatever one's opinion on what might be built, this planning permission by stealth that seems to have come about of late is simply wrong and utterly undemocratic.Residents and local people have a right to know what is happening or may happen in their neighbourhood.Even if it it is all completely above board, it nonetheless creates a scenario of underhand dealings and ultimately corruption.

Mark Kehoe ● 3892d

1A SOUTH EALING ROAD EALING W5 4QT  Ward :  Ealing Common  Proposal  Details of Arboricultural Method Statement pursuant to condition no.7 of planning permission ref. PP/2013/5667 dated 03/12/2014 for 'Redevelopment to provide a two storey building comprising of four x two storey residential houese with associated refuse area and communal amenity space following demolition of existing commercial/storage units'  Decision, Date of Decision and Sent Date:  Grant without conditions (23/04/2015) [23/04/2015] 

Simon Wycombe ● 3892d

No bribe needed.A wooden building which is becoming uneconomicto maintain, as this evidently was, becomesa fire risk, if nothing else. More especiallyas the site was formerly used for servicing cars so that over the years oil may have soaked into the fabric of the building.michael adams... 

Michael Adams ● 3894d

The lessons are that if the building was considered significant then it would have been listed. It was not so no action was /will be taken.

Nigel Brooks ● 3894d

Yes, the deed is done, but who's responsible for the situation and what lessons should we learn?

Gerry Tan ● 3894d

its irrelevant, or maybe relevant what it once was, But once gone its gone, irrespective of who,s to blame,A "bung", bribe, but time forgets theres no bringing it back

Peter Yale ● 3894d

Its a shame to have lost our urban architectural heritage of this once humble but important building. Btw, I don't think it was the fire station - that's further along St Mary's Rd I think.

Gerry Tan ● 3894d

It was cracking when it was Douglass' and as a small kid I used to look at the cars and think 'one day'.A Morgan though is not for everyone and as a 6' 4" ex-second row definitely not for me; although I would still love a Morgan three-wheeler.It was though really only a large shed and if no one had bothered to get it listed then, despite it's history, only building consent is/was needed to demolish it.

Nigel Brooks ● 3894d

I believe they only need to apply to Building Control for demolition. And BC would only notify the immediately adjacent properties. Shame, I liked that little building.

Terry Freestone ● 3894d

Colin Goodman surmised:I thought that building was listed as once part of a Victorian fire station or something?...The old fire station is just around the corner in St Mary's Square. Judging by the doors it was just large enough to accommodate one of the old fashioned horse drawn fire engines, with the brass helmeted firemen seated along the sides. Which isn't to say the demolished building might not have provided stabling for the horse(s) along with others.It does indeed seem strange that it was demolished without any notice. But off the top of my headand I stand to be corrected, but possiblybecause it was mainly timber construction and dated from the late 19th century ratherthan earlier, it wasn't covered by any statutory provision.michael adams...

Michael Adams ● 3894d

A bit more on F H Douglass, 1 South Ealing Road. W5Can't find pictures but several do exist.Edited from this link..  http://www.gomog.com/articles/douglass.htmlThe Morgan Motor Company in Worcestershire, and London's Ealing Electric Laundry both opened in 1909. So what? Well, Morgan has prospered ever since and, while the Ealing Electric Laundry was washed up decades ago, its premises today is home to F H Douglass, London's oldest Morgan dealer.Douglass and Morgan had been friendly rivals on Britain's motorbike racetracks in the 1920s. Douglass was a car salesman looking for a new challenge when his pal suggested he try selling Morgans, the then popular three-wheeler sports cars. The old laundry building was acquired in 1929, and he never  looked back.the place still exudes the aura of a 1920s village garage. Computers are artfully concealed. The air is thick with the smell of warm oil and damp leather. The walls are lined with framed pictures and Morgan memorabilia. And the workshop floor is littered with well-worn spanners, mallets, and wooden-handled screwdrivers.Mike Coram concentrates on mechanical work while Tony Hempel, whose business card states simply "Morgan Enthusiast", is front-of-houseF H Douglass is often besieged by tourists, but the company is very tolerant.  Coram said: "If someone wants to have their photo taken sitting in a car in our showroom, well, we don't mind. After all, it's the fact that Morgan culture isn't like any other that makes it so special."F H Douglass, 1A, South Ealing Road, W5.

Mark Kehoe ● 3894d

This was a bit of a surprise, I thought this was a listed building and also in a Conservation area and one of the more historic buildings that made it very much a part of Ealing's heritage.I have seen no notices about it's demolition or indeed about what is to replace it.Yet it stood just a few feet away from what is the original centre of the Village of Ealing ( Marked with a Black painted original Heritage Lampost ) so is in the very most historically sensitive area of this town.This was one of the earliest industrial and retail workshop and shops in Ealing.Until recently it was in the same family for generations.It was F H Douglas and Son and was originally a cycle shop. It also became the first and for a very,very long time the only sales and service dealer for Morgan Cars of Malvern. The little place was world famous long before the internet age. A completely unique place and more or less untouched until it became a Polish Deli around 7 years ago. Even then it just has a few superficial changes in the shop area. The rear entrance retained it's original classic sign written doors until the last few weeks.No doubt something completely inappropriate will be pushed through on the quiet if not already.

Mark Kehoe ● 3894d